[NU Sports] Other Facts About NU Football

Mon Nov 7 15:33:57 CST 2005

I suppose your next post will explain all the reasons that Basanez's statistics over the past four years should be discredited, because after all, most quarterbacks, even the best ones, don't start for four years and wouldn't have the opportunity to gain the same numbers.

The only reason such an explanation would be necessary, however, is if you thought we were all idiots.

The fact remains that Walker is the first coach since the 1930s to have 3 consecutive 6-win seasons.  I haven't seen any overreaction to that simple statistic.

I think it's good that the athletic department promotes positive statistics about the program.  That's their job.  Do we want them to release statistics with all kinds of caveats, instead?

On Monday, November 07, 2005, at 03:23PM, <cherron604 at aol.com> wrote:

> This '6-win' nonsense has to be addressed.
> 
>In today's Chicago Sun-Times, the beat reporter breathlessly reported that 'Walker is the first coach since 1931 to lead three straight NU teams to six or more victories.'  This smells very much like a press release from 1501 Central Street - and is pretty much as useful as most Athletic Department press releases.
> 
>What we know - RW has had 3 consecutive 6-win seasons.  The last instance of 3 consecutive 6-win seasons was indeed 1929-1931.
> 
>BUT
> 
>During the Dick Hanley era (1927-1934), Northwestern averaged 8.25 games a year.  These consisted of 5.38 conference games and 2.88 non-conference games.  That Dick Hanley could string together 3 6-win seasons (actually 6, 7 and 7) during this period means he averaged 6.67 wins per season in an era of 8 or 9 game schedules - or an 81% winning percentage during those 3 seasons.  This would be an incredible achievement in any era.
> 
>Randy Walker has strung together 3 seasons of 6, 6 and 6 victories (currently).  However, during the Walker years, Northwestern has averaged 11.7 games per year.  6 wins per year in an era of 11.7 game schedules works out to a 51% winning percentage...nice, but definitely nowhere near Hanley's achievement.
> 
>To equate Hanley's 6-3, 7-1 and 7-1-1 seasons with Walker's 6-7, 6-6 and 6-3 seasons is ludicrous.  It insults the intelligence of the listener, as well as discounting the real accomplishments of Hanley and many coaches who succeeded him.
> 
>To imply (as the comparison does) that Walker has achieved something not achieved since 1931 is absurd.  But it is all too typical of our Athletic Department - sugar coating numbers and presenting them in a way that inflates the accomplishments of RW while discounting anything that happened prior to RW's arrival.  (Anybody see any attendance averages in the Media Guide recently ?  They've been missing since the averages started falling during the RW era).
> 
>In fact, there have been numerous stretches since Dick Hanley of far greater accomplishment than RW's - Pappy Waldorf had an 8 year stretch (1936-1943) where he won 36 games, an average of 4.5 wins per year in an era of 8.42 games per season, or a 53% winning percentage.  Bob Voigts had 23 wins in the four seasons between 1948 and 1951 - 5.75 wins per year in a period of 9.13 games per year, or 63%.  Ara had a 6 year stretch (1958-1963) where he won 32 games - 5.33 wins per year while averaging 9 games per year, or a 59% winning percentage.  Alex Agase had 3 years (1969-1971) where he averaged 5.33 wins per season in typical 10.1 game seasons - 53% winning percentage.  And the demonized Gary Barnett won 24 games between 1995 and 1997, in typically 11.6 game seasons - a 69 % winning percentage.
> 
>Note too that all of these coaches with stretches longer than 3 seasons had even HIGHER 3-season winning percentages.
> 
>So quit believing that RW has achieved something that hasn't been done in 74 years.
> 
>IT ISN'T TRUE
> 
>Chuck Herron   Tech '85
> 
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Jeff Beamsley <jeffb at hilgraeve.com>
>To: 'NU Sports List' <nwu-sports at tssi.com>
>Sent: Mon, 7 Nov 2005 12:16:17 -0500
>Subject: RE: [NU Sports] Other Facts About NU Football
>
>
>Come on.  If you're going to post something like that about Ara, you have to
>post the rest of the story too.  These were nine game seasons, seven of
>which were in the BT.  The 1958 season came after an 0-9 1957 season.  The
>5-4 1958 season included wins over Washington State and Stanford.  The only
>blow-out loss was late in the season to Purdue.  The other three losses were
>by a touchdown or less. The 6-3 1959 season included wins over Wilkinson's
>Oklahoma (Big Eight conference champ that year) and ND and three loses to
>close out the season.  The only blow out was the last game at Illinois.  The
>1960 season again included wins over Oklahoma and ND, but then an early
>season blowout loss to Iowa.  The rest of the losses were close.
>
>These were really glory years for NU football and also years before the
>scholarship limits, so NU was really at a disadvantage to the bigger schools
>who could afford to have huge teams and stockpile talent.  The pattern at
>least in '58 and '59 was to start out strong and then fade as the team got
>worn down and injuries affected key players in the BT season.  
>
>RW has had a good run and it is great to see NU football improving,
>particularly in the BT, but part of that success was also built on wins over
>cupcakes like Ohio.  Our record against ranked non-conference teams isn't
>nearly so impressive.  
>
>Jeff
>
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: warneradams [mailto:warneradams at comcast.net] 
>Sent: Monday, November 07, 2005 8:45 AM
>To: rstetson at capps-assoc.com; jeffb at hilgraeve.com; 'NU Sports List'
>Subject: RE: [NU Sports] Other Facts About NU Football
>
>Ara did get post three consecutive winning seasons from 1958-60 although in
>two out of three years his teams had losing records in the Big Ten.  Randy
>has now posted three straight Big Ten seasons of .500 or better and 4 in 8
>years.  Ara managed that feat three times in his nine seasons.  Pappy
>Waldorf was the last coach to post three or more consecutive seasons of .500
>or better in the Big Ten (6 straight from 1936-41).
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: nwu-sports-bounces at tssi.com [mailto:nwu-sports-bounces at tssi.com] On
>Behalf Of Roy Lamberton
>Sent: Monday, November 07, 2005 7:37 AM
>To: jeffb at hilgraeve.com; NU Sports List
>Subject: RE: [NU Sports] Other Facts About NU Football
>
>The big thing [for me anyway] is that nobody coaching NU has had 3
>consecutive 6 win seasons since Hanley.
>
>Others have had better records during their time here, but they've never put
>together 3 consecutive .500 seasons.
>
>Back in the old days, it was harder to get enough top players to come to NU
>because a kid could go play at the local U on scholarship and sit on the
>bench.
>Now with 85 schollies, more top kids consider NU, but you have to give
>credit to RW & Co. for picking kids that will play in his system. 
>
>RW does have to have another big winning season or two to get over .500 for
>his time here, but the longer you coach somewhere, the harder it is to pull
>a long term record over .500 if you've had a couple of bad years at the
>start but Walker is on track to start to improve that career record at NU,
>and maybe wind up with one of the longer tenures at NU and in the Big 10.
>
>rsl
>
>++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>Roy S. Lamberton - Senior Associate
>Computer Applications & Support Associates and Publisher of Purple Reign,
>The Scout.com Northwestern University Site
>(http://www.purplewildcats.com)
>AIM Handle: CoachRoy74
>======== Go Cats -  Beat 'em All =========== Every time I think I've got
>this Computer Biz handled 
>            -- There's another upgrade.
>============================================
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nwu-sports-bounces at tssi.com
>> [mailto:nwu-sports-bounces at tssi.com] On Behalf Of Jeff Beamsley
>> Sent: Sunday, November 06, 2005 9:21 PM
>> To: nwu-sports at romaine.tssi.com
>> Subject: RE: [NU Sports] Other Facts About NU Football
>> 
>> 
>>  
>> Slow down there big fella.  
>> 
>> No disrespect intended to Pappy, but I think that Ara P. 
>> might have a bone to pick with you.
>> 
>> First of all, not including this year, RW's record from
>> 2000-2004 is 27-33 (.450).  Ara's record (plus one year of
>> Alex) from 1960-1964 is 24-21 (.533 my gosh a winning record!).  Alex 
>> turned in a 4-6 season in 1965 to make their combined six year total 
>> for the sixties 28-27 (.509 also winning!). Even if NU goes 3-0 the 
>> remainder of the season, that makes RW's record for this decade so far 
>> 36-36 (.500).
>> Close but no cigar.
>> 
>> Jeff
>>
>
>
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